Sorries

Safe to say, she didn’t imagine THAT.

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I’m very busy lately. We signed a contract for an apartment and are trying to figure out the loan now. There’s little time to do everything because I’m going to Poland in September aaaaaa!

Anyway, I finished listening to One Dark Window. It wasn’t my kind of thing, but it’s a good book. The romance wasn’t cringey (at least not for me, but I’m definitely not a connoisseur) and the worldbuilding was solid, even though sometimes I felt I was being fed it with a shovel instead of a spoon. Still, I read until the end with interest so if you like slightly-gothic moods, demons lurking in the mind, and magic based on cards, you might want to give it a go. Equal Rites I’m still reading, although I’m almost done. I’m making lots of notes with funny passages lol It’s also interesting to see how different a book that old is from what’s considered an industry standard nowadays. POV changing mid-scene? Absolutely. Breaking immersion by referencing modern-era things? Why the heck not. Foreshadowing? Meh, we can do without… xD But don’t get me wrong, it’s still entertaining. And I guess this is what the industry has forgotten in the meantime – that your average reader picks up a book to be entertained and there really shouldn’t be a strict template to writing a good story. But I guess a noob like me is better of sticking to the rules.

I have very little time to draw and write ; _ ; Please keep your fingers crossed so that we figure out that loan quickly and things calm down. I’m so tired.

27 comments on “Sorries”

  1. Nierninwa Reply

    I am glad she gets called out. It was not an okay thing to do, and she needs to understand why. I know it was not maliciously done in an attempt to intimidate, but she still put Robert in a sexual situation without his consent.

  2. Thisguy Reply

    What kind of crazy fantasy? A lot of movies and shows come to mind…
    Which just goes to show that you shouldn’t treat those things as examples of proper behaviour.
    Hopefully Robert will handle this tactfully and explain that while he sees her, he’s just not into her.
    … and hopefully she will accept it.

    • JW Reply

      I can’t help but think the world might be a better place if “proper behaviour” wasn’t still so much influenced by what the Victorians came up with, though.
      I mean, its a bit weird for nudity to be so taboo, considering we’re born naked and no other animal on earth has issues with it.
      Which isn’t to say that what she did is okay even if we ignored her state of undress. She still invaded his personal space and disregarded his feelings, which I think he’s made clear enough on earlier occasions.

      As for crazy fantasies, I think a lot of guys, in the privacy of their own mind, wouldn’t kick her out of an imaginary shower. But yeah, reality isn’t fantasy. In reality I’d probably be scared witless of a person crazy enough to do that. Smells like yandere territory. 😛

      • W. Reply

        to quote and develop a bit a good explanation on the taboo of nudity from EGS : the reason for this taboo is the expectation.
        Unlike any other animal, we are clothed most of the time, so when we get naked, it immediately bring the context of why.
        If in the shower, being naked is normal. on a beach, being almost naked is not a problem (the same people that could rage at the sight of a bit of thigh being accidentally seen in winter in public transportation would not do so seeing the same exposed by a bikini in summer by a swimmer)
        when going up to a person of the opposite (or same) gender in a semi private or isolated place… then the expectation, either negative as the story, or positive, is natural, and avoiding both the subject and the situations caused by misinterpreting things are the source of the taboo.

          • W.

            “then this taboo should be universal”
            on the contrary : the expectation are shaped by the society, so the taboo borne from the expectation are not universal.
            (unlike, for example, the taboo of incest, which comes from a mix of an instinct and filtered down knowledge of the consequences instead, and is universal)

            The taboo of nudity predate the victorian, and both it and homophobia can be linked to latitude : colder climate had stronger taboos when the population had little actual interaction, before colonialism and mondialization (after, there were so much cultural exchange, cultural expansion, cultural rejection and deliberate manipulation that it dwarf that phenomenon) .

          • JW

            You didn’t mention any of that before, though. I agree that adding that does improve the explanation.

            But looking at historical account on that wikipedia page, even just limited to northern regions, then the attitudes towards nudity have changed a lot more than if the current taboo on nudity was just to do with a specific expectation of removing clothes. Swimming naked in rivers/lakes used to be normal, breastfeeding in public used to be normal, etc. The expectations for many situations have changed. And not always for the better.
            Why is that? Is that just a vicious circle where it becomes less and less normal because we encounter it less and less in non-sexual situations?

            I think a good explanation of this taboo, a really good explanation, should explain why it exists in one place and not another, why it exists at one time and not another, and why it changes.
            Which is probably far too much too ask for in the comment-section of a webcomic. But looking at the historical data, things are a lot more complex than is explained by “we typically wear clothes at high latitudes and therefore have (sexual) expectations when they’re taken off, and then we conquered the world and forced our frustrations on everyone else”.
            For example in ancient Rome and Egypt there was also shame in being naked, but there it was because it was associated with poverty and slavery. But like you said, it also depended on the situation, because during some types of work it was normal. And in fact, even in Britain in the 19th century in the coal mines, working naked was normal. Because it was hot and you didn’t want clothes to catch on things in the narrow tunnels and get stuck.

            And of course the real question is, wouldn’t we be better off without it?
            That also turns out to be a lot more complicated than I had initially considered. I had a small discussion with the chatbot at perplexity.ai, and interestingly, both the taboo on nudity and normalizing nudity risk exacerbating gender inequality by sexualizing women more. Damned if you do, damned if you don’t.

        • alex Reply

          I think it’s a good explanation for the context of this scene. Dan must’ve put earnest thoughts into this after Grace’s kinda “oblivious nudist” attitude became more than just a running-gag, and there must’ve been all kinds of feedback from fans adding their 2 cents as well. I don’t know how much science is behind his explanation (but one could always ask him that directly on Twitter/X), but I personally agree with it and it looks like this Replay-scene fits the bill as well. Doesn’t mean it has to apply to all cultures in history of course.

  3. Refugnic Reply

    Robert wait! We need to talk!
    and lo, behold, he stops to walk.
    I’m sorry, see, I was just thinking,
    ‘Thinking what?! Have you been drinking?!’

    Did you think I’d enjoy flashing?
    Did you think you were that dashing?!
    Did you think I’d fall for you?!
    Tell me, did you think this through?

    Did you think, I’d change my mind?
    No thanks! I’m through with girls your kind!
    And just which crazy fantasy,
    would dress you down this casually?!

    ‘Why’, she whimpers, teary eyes,
    ‘Am I this ugly?’, almost cries.
    “What are you…I’m not saying that!”
    I just want someone else in bed…

    You see, you’re pretty, funny, kind,
    and who won’t see it, must be blind.
    But see, my heart, belongs another.
    Find someone else, with me: Don’t bother.

  4. Alex Reply

    Next page Sofia: “My ugliness is not the point? Waaaaaaah!”
    But yeah, Sofia was too direct. She should’ve inquired about the sandwiches instead. That way I— I mean, the plot – would’ve gotten closure. 🙂

    Glad to hear that you’re still enjoying Pratchett. I never really bothered to check what the industry standard is. I thought that since there are so many books out there that there’s got to be so much variety in styles that there’s no standard. I mean, a standard is always a sort of safe bet, but a big company can afford adding a lot of variance. I don’t think Harry Potter was within any standard, because J.K. was too poor to afford heating, so I don’t think she had a prior education in that direction. Also since I’m mostly reading online comics I am actually as far away from any standard as you can possibly get because some people just seem to go into this unprepared and wing everything by writing whatever they want however they want. XD

    Regarding foreshadowing…. well, if you had listened to me and tried out Hogfather, then you would’ve gotten some. 😉 Just look out for the “jingle jingle” sound if you end up reading it. I think Carpe Jugulum (another Witches novel) foreshadows something as well, but it’s subtle and too spoilery for me to hint at it, similar to what you did with Maki.

    Also you’re neither a noob nor do you stick to “the rules” in some regards, e.g. Sheena’s ~50% combat winrate makes her neither defenseless nor super powerful, and I like that.

    • NotImportant Reply

      By foreshadowing I meant more obvious things, like having a major character appear in the middle of the book (Simon) which was, at least to me, a bit jarring. Still, I enjoyed it (I’m done now) and will probably pick another one from the witches sub-series, either now or after some other book.

      • Alex Reply

        I see, and I guess it makes more sense to call the more obvious things foreshadowing, because how much of a foreshadow is it really if you can barely pick up on it.
        Btw: I hadn’t picked up on Pratchett changing perspective mid-dialog until you pointed it out, but now that you mentioned it I do notice the unusual-ness of that style. 🙂

        Anyway, glad to hear that you enjoyed it! Picking the witches series is definitely a good choice.

  5. EnterTheNameHere Camp dweller Reply

    I just want to write this:

    He’s 26, had at least one girlfriend and loves Ada.
    She’s 22 and all we know is she’s shy and has low self esteem.
    They are in situation where they both saw dozens if not thousands of people getting violently killed and eaten by monsters – eaten… by… monsters… Military and guns were useless in protecting survivors. Eaten. By. Monsters.
    Yet they found a “safe” place. Hell, they even built showers. If you don’t know what I’m pointing at – they could build a shower – in a world occupied by monsters eating people. Probably listening for any sound, looking for any movement in ready to run mode.

    Now you have a girl – no, let’s face it, still a kid socially – suddenly finding herself in these settings. I’ll even be nice and won’t go in direction she might in reality be manipulative sociopath, but she really is the shy and scared girl.

    Also, you have a guy who has some social experience, from what we saw, who just got back from a mission where he risked his live in empty city, suddenly battling with mass of monsters, watching his love getting hurt, somehow escaping and having to bring his love back to camp, I bet leaving him with even more questions.

    Now maybe you’ll laugh reading what people think is proper too…

    • Matheus Reply

      Cool story bro, but “proper” is something subjective to each person. EVEN if they’re both in an apocalypse where people get eaten by monsters, each one sees it differently. Sofia is a girl who might be afraid she will never see Rob again, since he literally almost died a couple days ago. Rob is a guy that has delusions about someone who does not love him. Still, it’s his body and own mind to deal with.

      AKA you said a whole lot of nothing.

    • Thisguy Reply

      I actually agree with this.
      I find the comments and this whole situation very interesting, because it seems to be judged by modern real world values. And yes, this is sexual harassment when judged by those values.

      But in this post apocalyptic world, there are other factors at play. They don’t excuse anyone’s behaviour, but they can explain it.
      Sophia’s clearly trying to cling to Rob for some sense of stability. He saved her, and he’s a person from her past.
      I actually feel very sorry for her.

      Rob’s entitled to be annoyed, he’s clearly in an emotional state as well, but… I’m not sure his reaction is the best one for long term cooperation. He doesn’t really have the luxury to just cut people out of his life like you might in the real world.

    • JW Reply

      Rob is a guy that has delusions about someone who does not love him.

      I disagree with that. I’m pretty sure Ada love’s him, just not in a dive-into-bed-together way. But she’s way too jealous for it not to be more than just affection between friends.

  6. Matheus Reply

    He’s got a point, but we all know if it was Ada instead of Sofia surprise flashing him he would be stupidly happy, EVEN if they didnt kiss before or anything.

    • JW Reply

      I guess you’ve got a point. Technically, Rob shouldn’t be objecting to being surprised flashed in general, but to being surprise flashed by someone he’s already rejected a couple of times and has no interest in seeing naked.
      With these kind of things it’s really important to make sure the recipient will like what you’re doing, and not go out on a limb just hoping they will.

      • W. Reply

        the point would be the other way around : instead of “only reject being flashed by someone he rejected”, it should be “reject being flashed unless by his actual long term girlfriend”
        even if he had not rejected sophia explicitly (or if it had been their first meeting), he would be right to not appreciate it.

        • JW Reply

          Well, I didn’t really mean to imply that Robert ought to reject anything in particular, just that what he said was probably broader than what he meant. And on second thought, also narrower than he meant (he probably doesn’t want to be flashed by Sofia if it’s not a surprise, either).

          It would be interesting to see how Rob would react if Ada surprise flashed him. Probably an interesting mix of conflicting impulses. I wouldn’t actually be surprised if he’d still pull a shirt over her head to hide his own embarrassment. But he’d probably also be stupid happy that she was interested enough in him to do that.
          Unfortunately, I doubt we’ll ever see it.

  8. anon Reply

    I think the reason it’s okay for Equal Rites to reference modern things and break immersion is that it’s meant to be comedic and at times parodic, not a completely serious work of high fantasy.

    • NotImportant Reply

      That is fair! I still read funny fantasy that didn’t do that, even if it parioded standard fantasy tropes and so on.

  9. LordViking Reply

    I hope she does not run away on the next page, aside her being naked and it having been a bad idea to do this, they need to have this talk and get their feelings in the open.

  10. t3hOgre Reply

    Rob blew the perfect chance to point and say, “So, wow, you really are a natural purple.” Alas, they both had to go for the weepies. Sooo much drama. We need a Laura smirk and well placed accidental Kasper butt to let our shrinking violet (do cold showers shrink purple flowers?) know she is loved – who says dystopian futures have to be so dystopey (I’m sure that’s a word somewhere). Otherwise, turn to the dark side she will. It’s not like it’s High Fantasy or something which is required by author lore and law to remain utterly humorlous. Could you imagine the Hobbit without Bifur, Bombur, and Bofur? Page after endless page of that Stearn fellow waving his log around and that smelly one going on and on about his dear ring. Can you imagine? Speaking of turning Dark Sides and purple violets though – don’t think we’ve forgotten about the twins with your nefarious gratutitous naked Sofa-butts, NI…

    Right as always, Crestlinger. Well, not always or mostly even, but here you are correct. 😉

    Don’t be afraid to break the mold a little, NI. Or drop it on someone’s desk (be sure to leave a dent) and dance around with your hands over your head shouting, “The words, the words, they’re everywhere!” Write what comes to mind and falls from your heart – the brain makes the story up and the heart tells it. Drive your broadsword in to their chest as you lean in to watch the life leave their eyes with your wavey read hair and icy blue eyes, lick their nose and leave them guessing for all eternity. As though you need to be told how to tell a story, right? And you call yourself a Noob, please, you’re right Alex.

    If you try to fit it in to someone else’s box or workshop talking points – it won’t be uniquely yours and will just come off flat. Or you’ll realize your old one day and have a drawer full of stories no one has ever read (besides your mom) because you wanted them to be perfect (cough) and were afraid to be funny in writing (cough, cough) – there has got to be someone out there that likes puns, ogres, and gratuitous faerie dandelion wars besides me right? Practice your free-writing like I write my comments – well not like I write my comments, but you get the point – and you might surprise yourself and someone else. I think if you try not to think about the box or what some office-jockey thinks about your work – you’ll feel better about it. Besides, the work of story telling and publishing is all politics at this point and if you don’t know someone who knows someone – it’s hard to get a foot in the door. The best way to bypass that is do what you’ve already done and build the audience you already have – someone will notice the crowd standing around you eventually and want to do something with it. There’s got to be a way to put our stories out there without going through an office – maybe we just need to think differently. I saw this one guy put something about Titan and a group of folks on some kind of art place once. Maybe with likes we get noticed? Get someone else to sell our stories…

    Hope you and FF are feeling better and your new digs are to your liking. Bests to all youse.

    • t3hOgre Reply

      Good Lord, that was long. I owe you a patreon for taking up so much room. 😉

      • NotImportant Reply

        Lol you don’t owe me a thing (it was actually an entertaining read so maybe I owe you something…?) but THANK YOU!!! I’ll be in touch about your upcoming avatar haha!

        I agree with pretty much all you said. The industry is difficult to get into. I don’t think I’m trying very hard to please anyone there, I already tried drawing for money and know how it drains me. Definitely wouldn’t want to do the same with writing. They’ll either like my stories as they are or I’ll one day present you guys with 10 indie-published books dug out from my drawer. And so be it~

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